Vintage Speed

Post by **toiga** » 31 Oct 2007 12:57

Boas,

Com a conversa do judson, voltei às minhas idéias originais dos motores pequenos mas reguilas.

Como podem ver nestes links que aqui meti, há toda uma série de pessoas que também curtem esta ideia.

burlyb.com : NATIONAL 36hp LAND SPEED CHALLENGE

http://www.oldspeed.ch/

The Samba : Drag Racing and a 36hp unlimited class

Pre 67 VW Foruns : Vintage Speed

Miguel Brito · Post by **Miguel Brito** » 31 Oct 2007 13:43

Então a minha opção ainda é um bocadinho mais psico: "vintage standard speed", guiar o animal com apenas 34 cavalos, mas metidos a galope.
O gozo maior é vencer em rallye carros bem mais potentes, mas com resultados ao fundo da tabela classificativa.
Quanto menos potência, maior a glória...

Eduardo Pinela · Post by **Eduardo Pinela** » 31 Oct 2007 15:18

Viva então a gloria da carroça vintage!!!! He! He!

Post by **toiga** » 13 Dec 2007 17:10

Boas,

Mais um site com este tipo de idéias:

http://vintage-speed.skynetblogs.be/

Isto é obrigar a pensar como se comsegue mexer num motor da mesma maneira como se fazia à 50 anos atrás, quando não haviam 1001 fabricantes de peças performance e acesso às (poucas) peças que existiam era muito escasso.

Edit: acho que se pode inserir este tópico : Mild tuning do fórum flat4ever.com. Como é na base do 1200, ainda se pode meter nesta categoria, hehehehe

nelsonsoares · Post by **nelsonsoares** » 14 Dec 2007 15:26

Eu tenho esse projecto em mente, manter o meu vw carocha de 1961 original no exterior e interior mas a nivel de travões, suspensões e motor modificar, axo que ficaria uma coisa bem feita.Muito tenho investigado na internet para fazer uma coisa demorada mas bem feita.

Jean Melim · Post by **Jean Melim** » 14 Dec 2007 19:53

E hás de fazer Nelson, é tudo uma questão de euros

Quanto a explorar o máximo de um motor é sempre uma coisa fantástica, eu acho que se podes, deves fazer sim Toiga... e já sabes que podes sempre contar com a minha ajuda no que puder...

cumps

Post by **toiga** » 16 Jul 2008 10:54

Boas,
Um pequano artigo de como se pode montar um bom motor 1200:

A Gearheads View of The Forty Horse Engine
By Bob Donalds

While reading an article on 36 hp assembly data and tips I was reminded of the steps I would take and things I noticed when I built forty horse and formula vee engines. The fv engines were based on 40 hp engines and saw 6000 rpm. I thought I would share some of them with you and the forty horse faithful. When I hang rods on 36hp & 40hp cranks I pay extra attention to rod and rod cap aliegnment. The 40 hp rod bolts go through the rod and screw into the rod cap leaving room for the bolts to move in the rod bolt hole. I use my set of feeler gauges, putting the largest blade that will fit between the rod and crank. This pushes both rod halves to one side. When the bolts have been lightly snugged, I install the end of the same size feeler gauge, twisting it just a bit as this will catch any edges that protrude, adjust as needed. Then after checking the rod for freedom of movement, and lightly tapping if needed at the matching numbers on the side of the rod as shown in the manual. Next torque the rod and recheck. Remember 40hp rods don't have the self-aligning capability that later ('66 & up) rods have. My average time is one hour for four rods.

The rod to crank side clearance very, depending on the manual you are using; most do not cover this. VOA gave their line mechanics a small book called: With Out Guess Work In it the clearance is listed two ways; New tolerance: 1) 007 to 0156 ths. and wear limit of.03 for the 36 hp and new tolerance: 2) .004 to .016 ths with no wear limit listed, for the 40 hp. I have used up to 018 ths with no problems. I think its important to mention that the pistons get lubricated by the the oil thats thrown off the con rods bearings.

The problems I've seen when reusing 40hp cases are the cam bore wear, this is noticeable just past the cam at the flywheel end, and the oil pressure light that can come on at warm idle. There is no replaceable cam bearing in the 36hp, and in most 40hp blocks. The camshaft sits right in the case itself. You can get heavy duty oil pumps for the 40hp that will keep the light out. Also Rimco, I'm told, bores cases for cam bearings in the forty horse.

Another tip, you can tell if your case did come with cam bearings without splitting the case. The boss, or the raised mating surface of the case halves, directly under the fan shroud, will be larger than the rest. Were talking about only the part that can't be seen with the fan shroud in place.

One other thing that comes to mind is the up grade for the forty horse cases The 1600 cases would make good replacment. The only dimensional difference is the cylinder opening. On the forty horse jug I would cut a groove in the cylinder with a lathe just below the base gasket surface. This groove is for an O ring this allows the cylinder to be centered in the slightly larger cylinder opening. This way I was able to use the later cases. This was also a SCCA legal upgrade for formula vee.

Some of the other things I did to Formula Vee engines were to hone the piston pin hole making the rist pin free floating in both the rod and piston. I also increased the skirt clearance by honing the cylinder to .004 ths, this lets the piston get the oiling and room to grow (heat expansion) that it needs to survive the higher rpms and temps that go with them. Speaking of higher rpms, not only do I use new valve springs, but I also shim underneath them to increase the spring tension. Shims come in .030 and .060 thicknesses. I have used two .060 shims or more if the valve is deeper in the seat. This increased spring tension allows the valve lifter to follow the cam through a broader (higher) rpm range without floating the valves.

The pistons rings are very thick in the old VW engines and when the top ring groove has worn it lets the rings flutter. Used pistons don't make power over 4000 rpm even with new rings.

The available exhaust valves for the forty horse does not have the all important chrome stem. In the past I've cut down the head of 1500-1600cc exhuast valves with the chrome stem for moderate to severe duty use, like a judson super charger, or any bus used on the highway. I suggest finding somebody, or a shop with a lathe for this job. Valve facing machines will not do this.

The next thing is the cam and the lifters. New lifters are different than the orginal; the head is thicker and the lifter is one piece, not two. This thicker head is good. The problem is the lifter head needs more room. If the clearance from the top of cam lobe to lifter is not at least .080ths., the litfer can, and does, hit the case. To correct this I cut the lifter bore with my die grinder making a raduis at the top allowing the lifter to sit lower. If This clerance is to small it can sound just like a rod rap, oh yes it can...

enhances the top 1/3 of the camshaft lobe where the valve is open the widest, effectively taking a larger breath with each opening of the valve. Later 1.1to1 rockers can be identified by the double fordge marks just above the rocker shaft.

on its edge, also increasing valve lift. I would also go so far as to grind the rocker arm surface that faced the valve. This way I could back the adjuster off even more, allowing me to use even longer pushrods. All this was a lot of work for numerous small gains that could make the difference in tight race class. I wouldn't even attempt to build an SCCA motor as such today, but as a point of reference I've seen them sell for $1500-3500, ready to race.

Most vee racers know who builds hot engines and what it really cost to build one up.

The cylinder heads are a topic that need an article by themself Gene Bergs article on heads is well worth checking out.

prosa · Post by **prosa** » 24 Aug 2008 16:12

Boas,

Artigo que compara um carocha na sua versão standard vs Judson vs okrasa - Battle of The Mouse Motors

Post by **toiga** » 26 Aug 2008 12:53

Boas,

prosa, obrigado por link. Ainda não conhecia. Obrigado pela partilha.

Fica aqui um outro link para os motores 1200 de 34hp : Area 1200:Performance Pages. É uma compilação de informação do fórum Volkszone.com sobre estes motores.

prosa · Post by **prosa** » 26 Oct 2008 12:06

Boas,

Hoje estava a ver um dos sites que o Toiga referiu (http://www.oldspeed.ch) e reparei que tinha o livro "Souping the Volkswagen" completo, tem piada que já tinha passado por este site um número de vezes e nunca reparei que lá estava

... a diferença que faz olhar para as coisas com os olhos abertos

Ainda só dei uma vista de olhos no livro, mas parece-me muito interessante e com umas figuras muito engraçadas, como por exemplo um gráfico com a potencia necessária para atingir uma certa velocidade. Ainda tem muito dados técnicos sobre os diversos kits existentes para vw na altura, assim como porsche 356 (para comparação).

Um abraço,

Post by **toiga** » 28 Oct 2008 17:16

hehehehe,

já imprimi esse livro!

prosa · Post by **prosa** » 05 Nov 2008 13:17

Boas,

No forum de Vintage Speed,The Samba - Vintage Speed Information on The Samba.

Chamo a atenção à tabela com o que esperar dos diferentes kits de época (potencia, velocidade de ponta)...

Um abraço,

Post by **toiga** » 05 Nov 2008 14:39

Ui,

esta nova secção do forum do samba é fantástico! tenho de ver melhor oq ue fazem...

PAVIK · Post by **PAVIK** » 07 Nov 2008 08:38

Bom dia...

The Samba jà conheço bem...

Projectos vossos é que não veijo nada????????????

Toca a mexer e colocar fotos vossas aqui no forum....

Até breve...

prosa · Post by **prosa** » 07 Nov 2008 10:36

Boas,

Podes ver o meu projecto, aqui no forum, no tópico 'Carocha 1200 '63 - Project Judson'.

Infelizmente, houve um percalço e 'ganhei' um eixo empenado. Agora está parado à espera de se tratar disso, em principio vou começar este fim de semana

Um abraço,